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  #141 (permalink)   iTrader 
Alt 2008-03-11, 17:40
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Üyelik tarihi: Mar 2008
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Merhaba iyinet bana yardımcı olurmusun sunucum donanım olarak çok iyibir makine fakat serverde en ufak sql işlemi olsa makıne kasıyor biçok sitemi kullanmayıyorum 1k hitli video sitemin sqli bile kaıyo nerdeyse aşagıda degerler var bu değerler 1k lik site ile olusan değerler 20k ya yakın bir sitemi actım an makşnem down olucak hale geliyor.
PHP- Kodu:
        -- MYSQL PERFORMANCE TUNING PRIMER --
             - 
ByMatthew Montgomery -

MySQL Version 4.1.22-standard i686

Uptime 
3 days 1 hrs 45 min 8 sec
Avg
qps 7
Total Questions 
2010204
Threads Connected 
3

Server has been running 
for over 48hrs.
It should be safe to follow these recommendations

To find out more information on how each of these
runtime variables effects performance visit
:
http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/4.1/en/server-system-variables.html
Visit http://www.mysql.com/products/enterprise/advisors.html
for info about MySQL's Enterprise Monitoring and Advisory Service

SLOW QUERIES
The slow query log is NOT enabled.
Current long_query_time = 10 sec.
You have 3454 out of 2010218 that take longer than 10 sec. to complete
Your long_query_time may be too high, I typically set this under 5 sec.

BINARY UPDATE LOG
The binary update log is NOT enabled.
You will not be able to do point in time recovery
See http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/4.1/en/point-in-time-recovery.html

WORKER THREADS
Current thread_cache_size = 0
Current threads_cached = 0
Current threads_per_sec = 5
Historic threads_per_sec = 1
Threads created per/sec are overrunning threads cached
You should raise thread_cache_size

MAX CONNECTIONS
Current max_connections = 500
Current threads_connected = 2
Historic max_used_connections = 340
The number of used connections is 68% of the configured maximum.
Your max_connections variable seems to be fine.

MEMORY USAGE
Max Memory Ever Allocated : 931 M
Configured Max Per-thread Buffers : 1 G
Configured Max Global Buffers : 17 M
Configured Max Memory Limit : 1 G
Physical Memory : 1.97 G
Max memory limit seem to be within acceptable norms

KEY BUFFER
Current MyISAM index space = 5 M
Current key_buffer_size = 7 M
Key cache miss rate is 1 : 7699
Key buffer fill ratio = 14.00 %
Your key_buffer_size seems to be too high.
Perhaps you can use these resources elsewhere

QUERY CACHE
Query cache is supported but not enabled
Perhaps you should set the query_cache_size

SORT OPERATIONS
Current sort_buffer_size = 2 M
Current read_rnd_buffer_size = 256 K
Sort buffer seems to be fine

JOINS
Current join_buffer_size = 132.00 K
You have had 0 queries where a join could not use an index properly
Your joins seem to be using indexes properly

OPEN FILES LIMIT
Current open_files_limit = 2500 files
The open_files_limit should typically be set to at least 2x-3x
that of table_cache if you have heavy MyISAM usage.
Your open_files_limit value seems to be fine

TABLE CACHE
Current table_cache value = 64 tables
You have a total of 170 tables
You have 64 open tables.
Current table_cache hit rate is 1%, while 100% of your table cache is in use
You should probably increase your table_cache

TEMP TABLES
Current max_heap_table_size = 16 M
Current tmp_table_size = 32 M
Of 45706 temp tables, 29% were created on disk
Effective in-memory tmp_table_size is limited to max_heap_table_size.
Perhaps you should increase your tmp_table_size and/or max_heap_table_size
to reduce the number of disk-based temporary tables
Note! BLOB and TEXT columns are not allow in memory tables.
If you are using these columns raising these values might not impact your
ratio of on disk temp tables.

TABLE SCANS
Current read_buffer_size = 128 K
Current table scan ratio = 1016 : 1
read_buffer_size seems to be fine

TABLE LOCKING
Current Lock Wait ratio = 1 : 2431
You may benefit from selective use of InnoDB.
If you have long running SELECT'
s against MyISAM tables and perform
frequent updates consider setting 
'low_priority_updates=1' 
nasıl configre ederim cpanel kullanıyorum yadımıc olursan sevinirim
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  #142 (permalink)   iTrader 
Alt 2008-03-11, 17:45
Member
 
Üyelik tarihi: Feb 2008
Nerden: Istanbul
Mesajlar: 122
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Tecrübe Puanı: 1
iTrader: %100/1
Bumber is an unknown quantity at this point
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Kafam basmadı bu işe

Intel e6600 fs 2.4 Core2duo
2 gb ram

Kod:
        -- MYSQL PERFORMANCE TUNING PRIMER --
             - By: Matthew Montgomery -

MySQL Version 4.1.22 i386

Uptime = 5 days 1 hrs 31 min 12 sec
Avg. qps = 26
Total Questions = 11764611
Threads Connected = 2

Server has been running for over 48hrs.
It should be safe to follow these recommendations

To find out more information on how each of these
runtime variables effects performance visit:
http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/4.1/en/server-system-variables.html
Visit http://www.mysql.com/products/enterprise/advisors.html
for info about MySQL's Enterprise Monitoring and Advisory Service

SLOW QUERIES
The slow query log is NOT enabled.
Current long_query_time = 10 sec.
You have 1 out of 11764632 that take longer than 10 sec. to complete
Your long_query_time may be too high, I typically set this under 5 sec.

BINARY UPDATE LOG
The binary update log is NOT enabled.
You will not be able to do point in time recovery
See http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/4.1/en/point-in-time-recovery.html

WORKER THREADS
Current thread_cache_size = 0
Current threads_cached = 0
Current threads_per_sec = 2
Historic threads_per_sec = 1
Threads created per/sec are overrunning threads cached
You should raise thread_cache_size

MAX CONNECTIONS
Current max_connections = 500
Current threads_connected = 2
Historic max_used_connections = 16
The number of used connections is 3% of the configured maximum.
You are using less than 10% of your configured max_connections.
Lowering max_connections could help to avoid an over-allocation of memory
See "MEMORY USAGE" section to make sure you are not over-allocating

MEMORY USAGE
Max Memory Ever Allocated : 92 M
Configured Max Per-thread Buffers : 1 G
Configured Max Global Buffers : 49 M
Configured Max Memory Limit : 1 G
Physical Memory : 1.99 G
Max memory limit seem to be within acceptable norms

KEY BUFFER
Current MyISAM index space = 301 K
Current key_buffer_size = 7 M
Key cache miss rate is 1 : 281
Key buffer fill ratio = 100.00 %
Your key_buffer_size seems to be fine

QUERY CACHE
Query cache is enabled
Current query_cache_size = 32 M
Current query_cache_used = 21 M
Current query_cache_limit = 1 M
Current Query cache Memory fill ratio = 68.65 %
Current query_cache_min_res_unit = 4 K
MySQL won't cache query results that are larger than query_cache_limit in size

SORT OPERATIONS
Current sort_buffer_size = 2 M
Current read_rnd_buffer_size = 256 K
Sort buffer seems to be fine

JOINS
Current join_buffer_size = 132.00 K
You have had 3753 queries where a join could not use an index properly
You should enable "log-queries-not-using-indexes"
Then look for non indexed joins in the slow query log.
If you are unable to optimize your queries you may want to increase your
join_buffer_size to accommodate larger joins in one pass.

Note! This script will still suggest raising the join_buffer_size when
ANY joins not using indexes are found.

OPEN FILES LIMIT
Current open_files_limit = 11095 files
The open_files_limit should typically be set to at least 2x-3x
that of table_cache if you have heavy MyISAM usage.
Your open_files_limit value seems to be fine

TABLE CACHE
Current table_cache value = 128 tables
You have a total of 808 tables
You have 128 open tables.
Current table_cache hit rate is 0%, while 100% of your table cache is in use
You should probably increase your table_cache

TEMP TABLES
Current max_heap_table_size = 16 M
Current tmp_table_size = 10 M
Of 118038 temp tables, 99% were created on disk
Perhaps you should increase your tmp_table_size and/or max_heap_table_size
to reduce the number of disk-based temporary tables
Note! BLOB and TEXT columns are not allow in memory tables.
If you are using these columns raising these values might not impact your 
ratio of on disk temp tables.

TABLE SCANS
Current read_buffer_size = 128 K
Current table scan ratio = 247 : 1
read_buffer_size seems to be fine

TABLE LOCKING
Current Lock Wait ratio = 1 : 6437
Your table locking seems to be fine
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  #143 (permalink)   iTrader 
Alt 2008-03-11, 17:50
iyinet - ait Kullanıcı Resmi (Avatar)
Paylaşım için teşekkürler
 
Üyelik tarihi: Sep 2002
Mesajlar: 6.336
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iyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really nice
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Alıntı:
stewie´isimli üyeden Alıntı Mesajı göster
Merhaba iyinet bana yardımcı olurmusun sunucum donanım olarak çok iyibir makine fakat serverde en ufak sql işlemi olsa makıne kasıyor biçok sitemi kullanmayıyorum 1k hitli video sitemin sqli bile kaıyo nerdeyse aşagıda degerler var bu değerler 1k lik site ile olusan değerler 20k ya yakın bir sitemi actım an makşnem down olucak hale geliyor.
nasıl configre ederim cpanel kullanıyorum yadımıc olursan sevinirim
Merhabalar, öncelikle belleğe göre my.cnf ayarları bölümüneki hazır paket ayarlardan makinanıza uygun olanı seçip uygulayın.
Değişikliği devreye almanızın ardından mysql 2-3 gün çalışsın.
2-3 gün sonunda my.cnf dosyanızın içeriği ve yeni bir mysql performans raporu ile yeniden yazın, kalan ayarları birlikte yapalım.
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  #144 (permalink)   iTrader 
Alt 2008-03-11, 17:52
iyinet - ait Kullanıcı Resmi (Avatar)
Paylaşım için teşekkürler
 
Üyelik tarihi: Sep 2002
Mesajlar: 6.336
Blog Entries: 2
Tecrübe Puanı: 3
iTrader: %100/6
iyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really nice
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Alıntı:
Bumber´isimli üyeden Alıntı Mesajı göster
Kafam basmadı bu işe

Intel e6600 fs 2.4 Core2duo
2 gb ram
Merhabalar, sizden de aynı şeyleri yapmanızı isteyeceğim.
Öncelikle belleğe göre my.cnf ayarları bölümüneki hazır paket ayarlardan makinanıza uygun olanı seçip uygulayın.
Değişikliği devreye almanızın ardından mysql 2-3 gün çalışsın.
2-3 gün sonunda my.cnf dosyanızın içeriği ve yeni bir mysql performans raporu ile yeniden yazın, kalan ayarları birlikte yapalım.
__________________
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  #145 (permalink)   iTrader 
Alt 2008-03-11, 17:57
Junior Member
 
Üyelik tarihi: Mar 2008
Mesajlar: 16
Tecrübe Puanı: 0
iTrader: %0/0
stewie is an unknown quantity at this point
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sağol iyinet peki cpaneldede etc/my.cnf bu dizindemi

etc/my.cnf dizininde

[mysqld]
set-variable = max_connections=500
set-variable = wait_timeout=50
set-variable = interactive_timeout=50
safe-show-database

bu sekılde var fakat bu my.cnf yi arkadaş elıylemi olusturdu ole hatırlıyorum cpanelde faklı biyerde olma itiamli varmı
Alıntı ile Cevapla

  #146 (permalink)   iTrader 
Alt 2008-03-11, 18:05
iyinet - ait Kullanıcı Resmi (Avatar)
Paylaşım için teşekkürler
 
Üyelik tarihi: Sep 2002
Mesajlar: 6.336
Blog Entries: 2
Tecrübe Puanı: 3
iTrader: %100/6
iyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really nice
Standart

Alıntı:
stewie´isimli üyeden Alıntı Mesajı göster
sağol iyinet peki cpaneldede etc/my.cnf bu dizindemi

etc/my.cnf dizininde

[mysqld]
set-variable = max_connections=500
set-variable = wait_timeout=50
set-variable = interactive_timeout=50
safe-show-database

bu sekılde var fakat bu my.cnf yi arkadaş elıylemi olusturdu ole hatırlıyorum cpanelde faklı biyerde olma itiamli varmı
cpanel konusunu uzmanlık alanım değil. Sorunuzun cevabını bilmiyorum.
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  #147 (permalink)   iTrader 
Alt 2008-03-14, 00:01
atay - ait Kullanıcı Resmi (Avatar)
henry lee
 
Üyelik tarihi: Oct 2005
Nerden: abhazya
Mesajlar: 1.593
Tecrübe Puanı: 4
iTrader: %100/2
atay will become famous soon enough
Standart

rapor şu şekilde:


[root@zeppelin kurulum]# ./tuning-primer.sh

-- MYSQL PERFORMANCE TUNING PRIMER --
- By: Matthew Montgomery -

MySQL Version 5.0.22 i686

Uptime = 2 days 21 hrs 0 min 56 sec
Avg. qps = 14
Total Questions = 3593733
Threads Connected = 1

Server has been running for over 48hrs.
It should be safe to follow these recommendations

To find out more information on how each of these
runtime variables effects performance visit:
http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/...variables.html
Visit http://www.mysql.com/products/enterprise/advisors.html
for info about MySQL's Enterprise Monitoring and Advisory Service

SLOW QUERIES
The slow query log is NOT enabled.
Current long_query_time = 10 sec.
You have 0 out of 3593755 that take longer than 10 sec. to complete
Your long_query_time may be too high, I typically set this under 5 sec.

BINARY UPDATE LOG
The binary update log is NOT enabled.
You will not be able to do point in time recovery
See http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/...-recovery.html

WORKER THREADS
Current thread_cache_size = 128
Current threads_cached = 15
Current threads_per_sec = 0
Historic threads_per_sec = 0
Your thread_cache_size is fine

MAX CONNECTIONS
Current max_connections = 500
Current threads_connected = 1
Historic max_used_connections = 16
The number of used connections is 3% of the configured maximum.
You are using less than 10% of your configured max_connections.
Lowering max_connections could help to avoid an over-allocation of memory
See "MEMORY USAGE" section to make sure you are not over-allocating

MEMORY USAGE
Max Memory Ever Allocated : 212 M
Configured Max Per-thread Buffers : 1 G
Configured Max Global Buffers : 170 M
Configured Max Memory Limit : 1 G
Physical Memory : 3.83 G
Max memory limit seem to be within acceptable norms

KEY BUFFER
Current MyISAM index space = 34 M
Current key_buffer_size = 128 M
Key cache miss rate is 1 : 18974
Key buffer fill ratio = 14.00 %
Your key_buffer_size seems to be too high.
Perhaps you can use these resources elsewhere

QUERY CACHE
Query cache is enabled
Current query_cache_size = 32 M
Current query_cache_used = 3 M
Current query_cache_limit = 4 M
Current Query cache Memory fill ratio = 10.29 %
Current query_cache_min_res_unit = 4 K
Query Cache is 24 % fragmented
Run "FLUSH QUERY CACHE" periodically to defragment the query cache memory
If you have many small queries lower 'query_cache_min_res_unit' to reduce fragmentation.
Your query_cache_size seems to be too high.
Perhaps you can use these resources elsewhere
MySQL won't cache query results that are larger than query_cache_limit in size

SORT OPERATIONS
Current sort_buffer_size = 2 M
Current read_rnd_buffer_size = 256 K
Sort buffer seems to be fine

JOINS
Current join_buffer_size = 132.00 K
You have had 9 queries where a join could not use an index properly
You should enable "log-queries-not-using-indexes"
Then look for non indexed joins in the slow query log.
If you are unable to optimize your queries you may want to increase your
join_buffer_size to accommodate larger joins in one pass.

Note! This script will still suggest raising the join_buffer_size when
ANY joins not using indexes are found.

OPEN FILES LIMIT
Current open_files_limit = 4510 files
The open_files_limit should typically be set to at least 2x-3x
that of table_cache if you have heavy MyISAM usage.
Your open_files_limit value seems to be fine

TABLE CACHE
Current table_cache value = 2000 tables
You have a total of 261 tables
You have 449 open tables.
The table_cache value seems to be fine

TEMP TABLES
Current max_heap_table_size = 16 M
Current tmp_table_size = 32 M
Of 62551 temp tables, 1% were created on disk
Effective in-memory tmp_table_size is limited to max_heap_table_size.
Created disk tmp tables ratio seems fine

TABLE SCANS
Current read_buffer_size = 128 K
Current table scan ratio = 819 : 1
read_buffer_size seems to be fine

TABLE LOCKING
Current Lock Wait ratio = 1 : 31
You may benefit from selective use of InnoDB.
If you have a high concurrency of inserts on Dynamic row-length tables
consider setting 'concurrent_insert=2'.

[root@zeppelin kurulum]#


teşekkürler.
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cesaret bilgisizlikten gelirse, cehalettir.
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  #148 (permalink)   iTrader 
Alt 2008-03-14, 02:01
iyinet - ait Kullanıcı Resmi (Avatar)
Paylaşım için teşekkürler
 
Üyelik tarihi: Sep 2002
Mesajlar: 6.336
Blog Entries: 2
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iTrader: %100/6
iyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really niceiyinet is just really nice
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@atay, ayarlar olmasi gerektiginden yuksek gorunuyor.
Bu az olmasindan iyidir.
Ancak tam olarak anlayabilmek icin mysqli kapatmadan 10 gun kadar daha bekleyip bu ciktiyi tekrar almak.
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  #149 (permalink)   iTrader 
Alt 2008-03-25, 23:18
bilmiyorum - ait Kullanıcı Resmi (Avatar)
Junior Member
 
Üyelik tarihi: Feb 2007
Mesajlar: 26
Tecrübe Puanı: 0
iTrader: %100/1
bilmiyorum is an unknown quantity at this point
Standart

tuning-primer.sh ile forumdaki örneklere bakarak yaptığım ayarlar ile 1 haftadır gözle görülür performans artışı sağladım.

Aşağıdaki son rapora göre kalan bir kaç problem var onları da çözmeliyim, kontrol ve yardım ederseniz sevinirim.

AMD 2.8 - 2GB RAM
my.cnf
Alıntı:
[mysqld]
set-variable=local-infile=0
datadir=/var/lib/mysql
socket=/var/lib/mysql/mysql.sock
log-slow-queries=/var/log/mysql-slow.log
log-queries-not-using-indexes

old_passwords=1
max_allowed_packet=64M
max_connections=200
query_cache_type=1
query_cache_size=32M
query_cache_limit=4M
skip-locking
skip-name-resolve
low_priority_updates=1
table_cache=512
thread_cache_size=256
key_buffer=32M
long_query_time=4

[mysql.server]
user=mysql
basedir=/var/lib

[mysqld_safe]
err-log=/var/log/mysqld.log
pid-file=/var/run/mysqld/mysqld.pid
Alıntı:

-- MYSQL PERFORMANCE TUNING PRIMER --
- By: Matthew Montgomery -

MySQL Version 5.0.54-log i686

Uptime = 2 days 0 hrs 3 min 10 sec
Avg. qps = 67
Total Questions = 11729337
Threads Connected = 1

Server has been running for over 48hrs.
It should be safe to follow these recommendations

To find out more information on how each of these
runtime variables effects performance visit:
http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/...variables.html
Visit http://www.mysql.com/products/enterprise/advisors.html
for info about MySQL's Enterprise Monitoring and Advisory Service

SLOW QUERIES
The slow query log is enabled.
Current long_query_time = 4 sec.
You have 154746 out of 11729358 that take longer than 4 sec. to complete
Your long_query_time seems to be fine

BINARY UPDATE LOG
The binary update log is NOT enabled.
You will not be able to do point in time recovery
See http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/...-recovery.html


WORKER THREADS
Current thread_cache_size = 256
Current threads_cached = 78
Current threads_per_sec = 0
Historic threads_per_sec = 0
Your thread_cache_size is fine

MAX CONNECTIONS
Current max_connections = 200
Current threads_connected = 1
Historic max_used_connections = 79
The number of used connections is 39% of the configured maximum.
Your max_connections variable seems to be fine.

MEMORY USAGE
Max Memory Ever Allocated : 286 M
Configured Max Per-thread Buffers : 537 M
Configured Max Global Buffers : 74 M
Configured Max Memory Limit : 611 M
Physical Memory : 1.97 G
Max memory limit seem to be within acceptable norms

KEY BUFFER
Current MyISAM index space = 2 M
Current key_buffer_size = 32 M
Key cache miss rate is 1 : 216636
Key buffer fill ratio = 3.00 %
Your key_buffer_size seems to be too high.
Perhaps you can use these resources elsewhere


QUERY CACHE
Query cache is enabled
Current query_cache_size = 32 M
Current query_cache_used = 14 M
Current query_cache_limit = 4 M
Current Query cache Memory fill ratio = 44.33 %
Current query_cache_min_res_unit = 4 K
Query Cache is 31 % fragmented
Run "FLUSH QUERY CACHE" periodically to defragment the query cache memory
If you have many small queries lower 'query_cache_min_res_unit' to reduce fragmentation.
MySQL won't cache query results that are larger than query_cache_limit in size


SORT OPERATIONS
Current sort_buffer_size = 2 M
Current read_rnd_buffer_size = 256 K
Sort buffer seems to be fine

JOINS
Current join_buffer_size = 132.00 K
You have had 7 queries where a join could not use an index properly
You should enable "log-queries-not-using-indexes"
Then look for non indexed joins in the slow query log.
If you are unable to optimize your queries you may want to increase your
join_buffer_size to accommodate larger joins in one pass.

Note! This script will still suggest raising the join_buffer_size when
ANY joins not using indexes are found.

OPEN FILES LIMIT
Current open_files_limit = 1234 files
The open_files_limit should typically be set to at least 2x-3x
that of table_cache if you have heavy MyISAM usage.
Your open_files_limit value seems to be fine

TABLE CACHE
Current table_cache value = 512 tables
You have a total of 162 tables
You have 322 open tables.
The table_cache value seems to be fine

TEMP TABLES
Current max_heap_table_size = 16 M
Current tmp_table_size = 32 M
Of 52129 temp tables, 1% were created on disk
Effective in-memory tmp_table_size is limited to max_heap_table_size.
Created disk tmp tables ratio seems fine

TABLE SCANS
Current read_buffer_size = 128 K
Current table scan ratio = 4774 : 1
You have a high ratio of sequential access requests to SELECTs
You may benefit from raising read_buffer_size and/or improving your use of indexes.


TABLE LOCKING
Current Lock Wait ratio = 1 : 2574
You may benefit from selective use of InnoDB.
If you have a high concurrency of inserts on Dynamic row-length tables
consider setting 'concurrent_insert=2'.
Alıntı ile Cevapla

  #150 (permalink)   iTrader 
Alt 2008-03-26, 00:05
iyinet - ait Kullanıcı Resmi (Avatar)
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Alıntı:
bilmiyorum´isimli üyeden Alıntı Mesajı göster
tuning-primer.sh ile forumdaki örneklere bakarak yaptığım ayarlar ile 1 haftadır gözle görülür performans artışı sağladım.

Aşağıdaki son rapora göre kalan bir kaç problem var onları da çözmeliyim, kontrol ve yardım ederseniz sevinirim.

AMD 2.8 - 2GB RAM
my.cnf
@bilmiyorum, oncelikle forumdan arastirip - ardindan sonuclari gozlemleyip - sorunu sordugun icin tesekkur ederim. Boylece hem sen ogrenmis oldun hem de biz sadece kalan sorunlar ile ugrasmis oluyoruz.

Veritabaninin bu hali ile my.cnf ayarlarini daha iyi hale getirebilecegimizi sanmiyorum. Veritabaninda sanki yeterince index yok gibi.

"You have 154746 out of 11729358 that take longer than 4 sec."
Bu satir 154746 sorgunun 4 saniyeden fazla surdugunu soyluyor. Sorgular tablo uzerinde index olmayinca uzun surer.

"MyISAM index space = 2 M"
Ya tablo boylarin cok ufak yada yukarida dedigim gibi tablolarinda yeterince index yok.

Innodb kullaniyormusun?

Replication kullanmiyorsan asagidaki satiri kaldir:
set-variable=local-infile=0

Veritabanin uzerinde calisan uygulama nedir (gizli bir bilgi degilse)?
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Konu iyinet tarafından (2008-03-26 Saat 00:07 ) değiştirilmiştir..
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